263: 5 ways to polarize a powerful woman | Dear Men

Jason Lange: And I think for a lot, certainly for myself and a lot of men, it is triggering for us because it triggers kind of for the alpha, the masculine, a lot of our core wounds of oh, we're not enough or we're not doing it right or there's something that we're not good enough for our partner because he or she is criticizing me or giving me some feedback or something. So then we immediately, oftentimes, at least I certainly used to and sometimes still do go into defending.

Melanie Curtin: Hi everyone. I have a fun celebration before we start this episode and I think the end of it is quite on point for our topic today. So this is a celebration. This is a message from one of my patrons. I got his consent to read this to you. Melanie. I'm a 45 year old man who separated a year and a half ago from my wife. Crushed that my wife ended the relationship. I was determined to learn how to do better with women. I struggled with connection. I couldn't open up, never got my needs met and often found myself in the friend zone. Your podcast was a critical piece in my transformation. I studied your podcasts which provided a number of reflections, AHAs and Mythbusters. Today I walk with confidence, clarity and presence. My language has changed. I'm open and unapologetically attracted to the feminine. I have gone from trying to please everyone and anyone that would like me to being able to choose what high quality woman is right for my needs and best of all, with integrity and authenticity. My bedroom game is addictive. Dick D I C K One of my biggest learnings is that I thought my sexual energy was a bad thing. Something that I had to keep in control and certainly not show outwardly and never in the presence of another woman. You have taught me that. In fact, my sexual masculine energy is my gift and as long as it is with clear intentions, I should have no apologies about wearing that energy. Specifically, I love the episode about language and how you model blunt, clear sexual language. And when I model this with women, they get wet. I've also learned that women seek connection. There is a direct correlation between connection and sexual desire. My new girlfriend just told me last night, the more I connect with you, the hotter you get. And I've learned that men are the granite that leads in the relationship. This is related to the masculine and feminine poles. This is still something hard for me, but it is my experience that even strong, successful women light up when I can take the lead. And that is the end of the note. I just love so many things about it, but I think One of the most powerful ones is the. Yeah, the part about leading and polarity. And that's a lot about what this upcoming episode is. So thank you for your reflections. If you are also someone who's gotten something out of the podcast or you have a question, you can always get me@dearmen podcastmail.com and if you would like to become a patron and support the podcast, you can just Google Patreon Dear Men podcast. It should come up right away. I would love to have you be part of our community. Thank you and welcome. And I appreciate all of you for being here. Hi, everyone. Welcome back to another episode. This is a Jason episode fan favorite. Today we're talking about five ways to polarize a powerful woman. And this is a topic that's come up in our group a bit lately in our coaching group, and I think it's something that is relevant for a lot of people because really, I mean, it brings up the question, what's the difference between a regular woman and a powerful woman? And really, there's very little difference. Right. All women are powerful. All men are powerful. All human beings are powerful. And I think that some people are more in touch with that side of them, more in touch with that. So that's sort of what we're. What we're talking about today is when you are a man partnered with a woman who is in her power and who is in touch with herself and the full range of herself, how can you skillfully work with all of her energies and actually polarize her so that you have a sexy dynamic and that so. And so that you can support all of her and not kind of make her small or try to make her small or try to make, like, smooth everything out. Polarity doesn't necessarily mean smoothing everything out. So just throwing that out there to start with. Yeah. So we're going to start with. So we have five, five ways we'll pace ourselves so we make sure to get through all of them. And if you have any questions about this, you can always get us@dearman podcastmail.com but yeah, I would love to start with our first one, which is meet her where she's at. So I'm curious, Jason, if you have any experience with this of maybe a moment of not meeting a woman where she's at and versus meeting her where she's at, what does that kind of mean? And how does it affect polarity?

Jason Lange: Yeah, I think I sometimes talk about this with our guys in terms of feel her, don't fix her. So as men, as humans, but particularly as men, you know, oftentimes we want to fix, right? We want to execute some kind of plan and take action. And often that'll show up in these situations with, you know, my partner is upset or struggling with something, and I immediately just want to go to, well, have you thought about this? Or we could do this, or how could we just fix the problem? And it rarely goes well. Certainly in my relationship, it could ask my wife. And, you know, it's still something I fall prey to of that, you know, and the impulse behind it. Like, I get it, guys. Like, we want to help. Men want to help. We see someone suffering, we want to help. But there's that tendency to kind of try to move her out of whatever she's experiencing, right? If she said, oh, I want to make her happy, like, what if we just solve this? Or whatever that might be. And it's that. That I think can be the triggering thing sometimes for partners and certainly feedback. I still get to this day, if I come in hot, so to speak, and I'm not doing the things we're going to be talking about in this episode of. Could you. Could you just be with me? You know, like, could you just stop? Like, I'll get that. And it's not off base. And then I realize, oh, yeah, I'm, like, in my head trying to fix the problem, and I'm not actually relating with my partner where she's at.

Melanie Curtin: That's a great point. It. It sort of reminds me of, like, if I come and I'm sad, right? I'm. If I come to a man and I'm sad and, like, I'm feeling left out. Like, my friends forgot to invite me to this thing and they only just invited me, and I just found out. He's like, well, you got invited. What's the problem? I think that's an example of. Yeah, that's not what I need to hear. You're not. You're not helping, and you're not fixing the problem. I'm over here. So I think this is actually a really good time to do a very brief review of alpha and omega as energies. So in the past, we've often used the words masculine and feminine, and we may use those a bit in this episode. But one of my teachers, London, uses the words alpha and omega, which map to the same energy. So alpha maps to masculine and omega maps to feminine. And we're going to use those words for today. And. And there's different versions and, you know, work around polarity. But for today, the way I want to frame this conversation is Alpha is thinking. When you're in Alpha, and everyone has both of these energies in them, as we shared many times and many people have one side more developed than the other. Alpha is thinking. It's thinking, it's doing. It's penetrating, it's planning, it's executing, It's. It's thinking. It's thinking energy, it's rationing. Rationality, it's logic. Omega is flow. It's feelings. It's. It's being in the moment. It's allowing. It's. It's. It's feeling. So really, Alpha is thinking. Omega is feelings. So when you're in Alpha, you're executing or you're thinking. You're often, you're. When you're working, you're. You're often in Alpha. When you're in Omega, maybe you're. You're surfing, you're with the waves, or you're dancing. You're in the moment. You're with the music, you're intuitively moving in. Being an Omega is. Is flow. It's a flow state. Some people reach it. People reach it in all kinds of different ways, but that's really what we're talking about. And so being in Alpha versus being an Omega, if, If your woman has come to you and she's sad about something and she's, you know, sharing with you vulnerably about her feelings, that's not the time to meet her in Alpha and quote, just fix it. Well, you got invited. Just. Just everything's fine. I don't understand. Why are we still talking about this like the, the trouble has passed. She's still in Omega and she wants to be met there. Or at least I do. I think a lot of women want to be met in Omega where they are in their flow. And so if you, if you're trying to get her out of that because you perceive her as, like, upset or there's something wrong, let me just, let me just fix this now. You got invited all as well. Yeah, but I, but I felt really left out. I have felt left out in this group for a long time. And this just reminded me of that. That's. That's not meeting her where she's at. So a version of meeting her where she's at is. That sounds really painful, right? Just naming and witnessing and being with your woman in her feelings and her flow and reflecting back to her how she's feeling. That's meeting her where she's at, really meeting her where she's at. And there's something that feels deeply nourishing to me as a woman, to be reflected when I'm in my feels. You don't have to fix it. You just have to witness it. So that's my version of I used to do a song, don't fix it. Just witness it. Don't fix it. Just witness it. And that's what we're talking about. It. We're not talking about if there's something around the house that actually needs to be fixed that's different. We're talking mostly when we're saying don't fix it is don't fix her emotions. She doesn't need to fix her emotions. A powerful woman is in touch with her emotions and she just needs to feel them. She just needs to feel them, and she wants you to be there with her as she's feeling them. That's all you need to do. You don't need to do anything else. And it's interesting because I remember reading a book years ago where a couple was about to go on vacation and they had kids, and it was this big whirlwind getting out of the house because they had a babysitter. They were going to go on a solo trip. They get in the car, and she just was like, I'm exhausted. And he had this whole internal experience around, like, oh, my God, is the vacation going to suck? Is she even going to be like, is she going to want to have sex? Is going to be. And because of everything he had learned, he chose not to try to fix it, which he would have done in the past. He was like, absolutely. I would have been like, well, maybe like, we can get you coffee or, you know, I just. All of this, like, thinking, right, Alpha energy. And instead he just dropped in and he said, kids can be exhausting, can't they? And she said, yeah. And then she perked up. She just perked up. That was it. It didn't need to be a whole thing. And in his head, he thought, holy shit, this is so much easier. This is so much easier. And I think that's a great example of the contrast between trying to fix it and meeting Omega with alpha energy, which doesn't work, versus meeting Omega with Omega energy, at least to start, right? Like, emotionally meeting her where she's at for me feels really good. And feeling, Feeling witnessed, feeling reflected and feeling kind of held. Yeah.

Jason Lange: Yeah, I love that. I think reflect is the key word there. That if you just remember, you're reflecting because the. The experience, you know, And I've. I've had this too, as a man. Like when someone can receive me and when they don't and they try to fix it. Like, this happens in men's groups all the time. But the it's. It's be another way to think. I think of this is being received. Like, if you're trying to change me already, you're not receiving me right. You're not actually with me. And I think what that can particularly feel like is, oh, you're not loving me. You don't love me because I'm away right now and you don't want me to be that way. So you're not okay with me as I am. So I don't feel loved. I know, it's. It's right. Like, but that's, it's not that it's like a conscious thought necessarily, but that's often the energetic feeling when someone doesn't receive us versus oh, I'll just be with you. Where you're at seems like you're feeling this right? And there's that kind of reflection there. And sometimes that's enough. Like you said in that example, in your experiences, sometimes that will do it alone. Sometimes more can happen after that, where she'll then kind of lean in. Well, you know, I'm wondering, like, do you think I'm crazy? Am I overanalyzing this or whatever? And then there might be a little back and forth. But you cannot skip that first step of, you know, it's really a step of resonance, of coming into the same space, connecting, just being with things as they're at, being with her, where she's at. And then things, you know, there's a lot more open and a lot more potential after that because you are connected. She's going to feel received, she's going to feel connected, and she's going to feel, oh, he's not trying to change me right now. And when we can feel someone's not trying to change us, in my experience, way more open to getting their opinion. Actually, when I feel like they're not, they don't have an agenda, then it's like, well, what do you think of da da da? And it really starts with that. Yeah, just meet them where they're at. It's like, you know, in the martial arts world, it would kind of be like aikido. Like, you just want to work with the energy that's there. You just, just work with the energy that's there. Don't even try to redirect it at first, but just meet that energy, be with it.

Melanie Curtin: Yeah, I remember. I like that. I was also thinking about aikido, because there's a way that you. When motion comes towards you, you accept that motion and then you redirect.

Jason Lange: Yes, exactly.

Melanie Curtin: And accepting and then a redirecting. And rather than resisting. It's not a resisting, it's accepting and redirecting. And I remember someone, years ago, there's a workshop or something, and they were describing this situation where a woman was really upset about something and really pissed about it. And I don't think it was about that man. I don't think it was about their relationship. It was something in her life. And he's. And he said something like, I love it. Bring. Tell me more. Bring it all. What else? What else you got? And that felt really good to me. It felt like, oh, he's not afraid of her rage. He's not afraid of her anger. He's not afraid of her grief. He's not afraid of her emotions. He's actually like, I got space for that. What else you got? I got space for that. What else you got? And to me, that's one of the sexiest things I can imagine is a container for my Omega flow. And I think this is something that I've been hearing a lot about lately is the feminine wants to be contained. And I'm not, again, not just talking about women, but everyone, right? Our Omega, our inner Omega wants to be contained. It wants to be held. It wants to be. It wants to be. It wants to know that it's not too much, right? And when you. When you feel like someone has a lot of space for whatever you're going through, you don't feel like you're too much. So that I remember, it was like this was a video or something. You could actually see the woman's body relax when he was like, give me more. Bring it all. I know there's more in there. Give it to me. You can see her just like, there's actually going to be space for me and all of me. And because of that, the tone actually went down, right? But when. When I. When I have experienced someone else not be able to have space for my omega flow, and I'm specifically thinking about, like, anger, frustration, like rage, like that place when I can sense that they don't. They're kind of resistant, they're resisting, I lock up and I tend to shut down. One of my ex boyfriends said, you don't explode, you implode. And I don't think I'm the only woman who does that. So I Think there's something important to include here in this discussion, which is you will only be able to hold her omega, to the extent that you have touched your own. So part of the reason it's so important to do personal growth work and to actually reach your own emotional depths is because you will only be able to hold her to the extent that you've held yourself. So I've been with. With men who I can feel their kind of resistance, especially around things like grief and rage, because they haven't gone there in themselves and they can't really tolerate holding it in someone else. They can kind of tolerate being around it, sort of, but not really. But they can't tolerate like, I've got this. I'm bring it. Bring. Bring more of it. Like, I'm here for this. I've got this. They can't do that part. So I'm curious if you can share just a little bit about your own experience with that. Because I think it's easy to say we'll just have space for her omega, but you actually need to do some work to be able to do that.

Jason Lange: Yeah, you, you have to. It's my version of that is you have to be able. You have to be comfortable going there yourself, inside yourself. Otherwise you'll be resistant oftentimes to experiencing and going there with other people. So if you haven't come into contact with your rage or your grief, right. This is where we'll sometimes avoid it because it's like, well, if that person's sad and I'm with them in their sadness, I'm going to feel my sadness. And that can be overwhelming. So I'm gonna try to gently nudge them away from that. Right. Kind of move away from. It's not that bad. It's not that big a deal. You know, have you thought about this or whatever? But that capacity in us is so key for us men to get to that point where we don't fear our partner's emotions. That's it. It's such a game changing moment when we're like, oh, just because she's mad doesn't mean it's the end of the world. Just because she's mad at me doesn't mean our relationship's over or that she doesn't love me. It's just, this is the temperature at the moment and can I be with that? And the more comfortable you've been in being that with yourself, gotten in being that with yourself, the easier it's going to be with her. And this is where again, like I often talk about a great place to train for this is in men's groups because you get to practice being around other men and their emotions and then you get to be in yours. And it's a safe space, so to speak, where there's not as much on the line as an intimate relationship. Right. Where you're like, I want to get this right. I really love my partner or whatever that might be. And obviously things like therapy as well are great places for you to get more in touch with your inner world. This idea of interoception and the benefit of that is the, the larger or the, the increase in capacity you have for identifying your own inner experience, hey, it's going to help you identify other people's as well and then be with them. And that's that key thing of, you know, when we can feel someone with us in our experience, something tends to relax. It is a type of containment, right? It's like, it's, it's a, it's a, it's a weighted blanket of consciousness of just like, oh, they're, they're here with me and nothing needs to change. And then oftentimes that allows us to feel it more deeply ourselves. And then it takes care of itself. A lot of times I'm glad you.

Melanie Curtin: Said that because I, my, my experience is that when I'm in something, if, when I'm in an emotion and someone's meeting me there and they're reflecting, so they're saying, wow, as you're talking about that, I'm just getting such a sense of loneliness. I really feel that. And I'm like, ah, yes, that's there. My experience is that as I feel met, my body relaxes. And as my body relaxes, it shifts, it shifts into the next thing. And the next thing is sometimes turn on if I'm with, you know, a romantic partner, relaxation or sometimes laughter or it shifts into the next thing. But much like the adage what you resist persists. When I'm with someone who's not meeting me where I'm at, or someone who's trying to fix me or, or I can feel, I can just feel their, like their tightness, their resistance, they're, they're pushing away of. They don't want to go there, they don't want to go there. If they don't want to hear about it, it's not even a conscious. But they're just like, their body, mind is like, nope, don't want to do that. Then it lasts longer and the volume goes up. So really what We're. What we're pointing to is that as you're meeting someone in where they actually are and reflecting back to them, it makes it faster, it smooths it out. Not that it smooths out the emotion, but helps to transfer to the next movement, basically the next healing movement. And we're going to talk about some more advanced practices later, but I think this is an important one of. This is sort of step one, no matter what, which is just meet her where she's at. Meet her in. In her Omega. And in this instance, meet Omega with Omega, right? You're in the feelings. You're in the feelings too, and you're reflecting them with her. The second one is. The second one is basically in polarity. Omega is flow. Omega is movement. Omega is expression. Alpha is stillness. Alpha is presence. Alpha is consciousness. If you want to polarize a partner. So one of my favorite examples was your woman has lost something and is scurrying around the house and freaking out. And in a form of just intense energy. I think there's a tendency, especially for nice guys and let's say a lot of the men that we've worked with, that we work with, to kind of meet her in that, right? To kind of like join her in the. Join her in the chaos, Join her in the. In the dance. And. Because he wants to help. And there's nothing wrong with that. We're not saying there's anything wrong with that. But energetically now you're both kind of in the same energy space and neither of you is still. So. So neither of you is taking the position of Alpha, right? That's actually like the chaotic feminine. So like chaotic Omega. It looks kind of like. Like this. Like there's a lot of movement, there's a lot of energy, there's a lot of flow, but it's not sort of flowy flow. And I remember being in a workshop on polarity, and a few of the men who were helping were kind of holding the space, and they were sitting spine straight, holding Alpha. Just the stillness and the presence. And it was almost like they were anchors around the room. And you could. I could feel I being an Omega, being mostly in Omega, I could feel them. I could just feel them. Even if I close my eyes, I could feel them energetically and my body kind of relaxed. So there's something about. Well, you. You can speak to this, but I think there's something about really knowing about this and embodying it and being able to embody Alpha that can help polarize a partner or the Moment. And it's not that you're not present, you are present. But instead of getting, getting fast and getting in motion, you're getting still, you're deepening your breath, you're feeling your feet on the ground, you're dropping into alpha in a different way. And you can even do this in the car. So, yeah, love to hear your experience of this. Did, did you used to do something different? Do you do something different now? Or what is this? How does this show up for you?

Jason Lange: Yeah, I mean, I think another way to think about this is slow your mind and get into your body just right. Can I connect to my breath? Can I feel my feet anchored on the ground? Can I slow myself down? Right. Doesn't mean you're not feeling, just means instead of right. Thoughts, often in particular tend to have a faster vibration. And it's a place where us men can easily get trapped. So if our, our partner comes at us with some chaotic emotions or feelings or thoughts, Right. Oh, my God. What does this mean? How am I going to fix this? Should we do this? Should I do that? And that's gonna like, add. That's gonna add to the, to the, the energy of the moment versus what we're talking about here is, yeah, there's something going on with your partner. You're gonna meet her, where she's at, and then what do you do with yourself as a man in that? Ah, okay. Yeah, I'm gonna anchor, deepen my breath. I'm gonna kind of wrap my awareness around us, around her, around the room, and just, yeah, kind of energetically hold this moment. And that takes practice, right? That takes practice for us as, as men. But I think what you said noticing in that workshop, there's, there's. It's transmissible. Like, we can feel it. Right? It's one of the things that first got me hooked on men's work was when I was around men and I felt like, oh, fuck, this guy's on a different wavelength right now. He's like deep and relaxed and very much here. And I can tell he's not ruminating, right? Like, I could just tell he's not ruminating like he's present and that it feels really good to be around. And so as men, learning to cultivate that in our body, mind in the moment, right? Accessing that Omega, coming to that more kind of still witnessing place that alone can do so much for a partner. Right? You're letting her have her experience, and here we are just solid still. Maybe you're looking her in the eye and you're just welcoming it. All right. You're just, yeah, I got this. I'm here with you. And sometimes that alone can totally change the nervous system of Omega. Right. Can see this often and ah, just like that, exhale kind of comes in. But it's a big part of it starts with us, what's going on in our body mind. If we're not relaxed, it's going to be really hard for our partner to relax. And one of the biggest ways we often talk about that you can facilitate relaxation in the body, deepen your breath. I don't even have to say a word. And you can shift the energy.

Melanie Curtin: Yeah, it's one of the things that we've mentioned before. Whoever in any space is holding, is, is breathing more deeply. Whoever's breathing more deeply is holding the masculine pole in that moment. Whoever is breathing more deeply, whoever's body mind is more relaxed is holding the masculine, holding the alpha pole in that moment. I think that's something that gets confusing in our culture because we actually associate acting out sometimes or raging as masculine. But actually that that man is in Omega in that moment. That loud big expression that that's not alpha energy. Alpha energy is still straight, present, deep breath. No, it's not that there's not a boundary there or that you can't be powerful there, you can be deeply powerful there. But the rooted, grounded, open, expansive conscious quality, that's Alpha, not Omega acting outness, that's not the same thing. So I think that's a really important one because there's no way to fake it. There's no way to fake it. And I think one of the things that I've witnessed in our work with our men and something that I've appreciated is watching men learn to cultivate this alpha state. Learning to really drop in and cultivate does take something. So if you're holding a bunch of tension in your body mind because of old traumas and old experiences, it's going to be harder for you to access this alpha state. It's almost like you need to clear out some crap in order to access that depth of presence. And it's worth it. It's worth it. And I think that's. Yeah, that's something that I've noticed is just, I'm thinking of one of our, one of our clients who was very just like there was a lot of motion happening when he first started working with us. There was a lot of just sort of like, you know, when he would share, there was just a lot of, just this kind of thing. And you know it. You can feel kind of like how it polarizes, how this polarizes the rest of the room in a certain way. Like a lot of people get. It's transmissible like you said. So that state is transmissible. And by the end of the program there was much more stillness and his sentences were more complete and there was more of a sense of I could follow what he was saying better and more. And he had led a couple of really difficult conversations with someone that he'd been in a relationship with and they had just gone better and with more depth and more love than ever. And he kind of took responsibility for some things that had happened and just, he said I could just see her whole body relax. Like her whole being just relax and feel met in a different way. And I think that's sort of a testament to the work. And that was over the course of a few months. It doesn't have to take forever. I think that's one of the things that I really celebrate about personal growth work is yes, some things take a long time and some things don't. You can actually make a lot of progress in a short amount of time because our bodies are flexible, our minds are flexible, there's brain elasticity. You can build new neural pathways. We put our attention on things, we get the right support, we're in the right community and things can shift. So I think that that capacity to hold Omega. Sorry to hold Alpha and be still deep in your breath, open your body mind, you gotta do some work to get there. And then once you can get there, I think can get easier and easier over time. And then it's just a matter of kind of like remembering like, right, right. She's doing her dance, she's in her flow, she's. She's doing her thing. Ah, I'm right here. We're gonna find your phone. Like, it's, it's not necessarily about the words. It's really about, I'm really here with you. You're not alone. It's gonna work out. And not from like, it's gonna work out. Stop freaking out, stop freaking out, stop freaking out. No, it's gonna work out. It's gonna be fine. It doesn't feel that doesn't feel the same as the embodied expression of I'm here, I'm with you, you're not alone. I think that's really what a lot of the freak out energy is like. Oh my God. Oh my God. Is it going to be as okay? Is it going to be okay? Am I Gonna. Am I gonna. And just the balancing out of that can be deeply relaxing. I know we're right in the middle, but I guess I would just say that also, these principles only work when both partners want to play. These principles only work when you're with a semi receptive or fully receptive partner who can drop into Omega. If you're with someone who has borderline personality disorder or narcissistic personality disorder or some kind of other thing going on, particularly the personality disorders, this isn't going to work. So I just want to say that up front and we will drop in that episode of. Do you feel like you can never win with her? This might be what's going on. Because if you are with a woman and you're like, I've tried these things, or I try everything and nothing seems to help, there may be something else going on. So I guess I just wanted to say when I'm doing my freakout thing and my partner is dropping into alpha and helping polarize me, there's a part of me that's willing to be polarized. There's a part of me that's willing to meet him and lean in and be. Be in partnership. If I'm not available for that, there's nothing that can be done. That's. That's it that I. It's. It's like partner dancing. If you're trying to dance salsa with me and I'm just standing there, I'm not dancing with you. We can't dance. There's no way to do it. Even if I'm not a great dancer, if I'm trying, if I'm trying, we can dance. If we're both trying, we can dance if one person's not trying. So I just wanted to throw that out there because I think that could be. That could be something that's going on. If you're listening to this and you're like, I've tried all these things, or I keep trying things, I can try these things, but I don't have a lot of hope. There might be something else going on. So that was the second one. Get still. I think we should move on to the third one. The third one is. Is. Is interesting. And it's. It's. This is. So this is not necessarily when she's in distress. So we're sort of. We've sort of covered some things of, like when she's upset about something. When she's upset about something that's going on in her life or something that's going on in the Environment, something like that. And actually, I guess I would just say briefly before we move on, this might be the most important point. In my experience, the riskiest thing for me to share in relationship is when my partner has upset me. So when, when the story. I've been with multiple men and I've talked to my women friends about this, where he's got a lot of space and he can hold a lot of space. If I'm upset about something. Not that's not him. So if I'm upset about something at work or something with my friends or something with my family or something, boy, he's spacious. He can be an alpha. He's receptive. He's just like containing. He got me. But then as soon as it's about us or about him, something he did that had me feel alone or had me feel dropped or anything like that, that's really scary for me to share because in my experience, that is when men get defensive the most. It's when they get the most defensive and it's when they get the most frequently defensive and it feels really scary. And so I think that maybe you could speak a little bit to this. But I think there's a particular kind of. It's not different, I guess, is what I would say, is it. It might feel different to you because like, oh my God, it's about me. Like, I've got to, I've got to attack, I've got to defend. Like, I've got to put up my defenses. But in my experience, all the same principles apply of actually relax your body, deepen your breath, be as receptive as you can be, and that will help you be able to listen and actually hear what she's saying. Because particularly more skillful women, they're not going to be attacking you. It's not the attack that your body mind might think that it is, if that makes sense. And so what you want to do is you really do want to drop into alpha in order to be able to hear what's being said. Because sometimes when your defense mechanisms kick in, they change what you hear, so you hear the worst version instead of what's actually happening. But can you speak a little bit to that? Because I've found that repeatedly. And what have you found helps in that?

Jason Lange: Sure. It's totally been a journey for me in my marriage to be able to take feedback honestly. And I think for a lot of, certainly for myself and a lot of men, it is triggering for us because it triggers kind of for the, the, the alpha or the masculine a Lot of our core wounds of, oh, we're not enough or we're not doing it right, or, you know, there's something that we're not good enough for our partner because he or she is criticizing me or giving me some feedback or something. So then we immediately, oftentimes, at least I certainly used to and sometimes still do go into defending. Well, it's actually this or I didn't intend to do that. And like, there's a. Which is similar to what we were talking about in point one of kind of trying to explain her out of her current feeling, whether we, you know, because we don't agree with it or whatever that might be. But a lot of times it's because there's. There's fear under there. There's fear of getting rejected or a partner, you know, not being happy with us in us, or us just being uncomfortable with that tension. Right. Her anger or her grief. So then we want to try to move it. But, yeah, one of the biggest shifts I've certainly been able to make is to be able to tune into, okay, what is she offering me? Can I just receive it right now? Like, I don't. This isn't an argument, I think, for a kind of term I've been noticing in myself and a lot of men is it's very easy for us to go into lawyer mode. We become lawyers about the experience, and then we want to argue it and convince our partner how our perspective is the right one, which there's a time and place for. But usually in these moments you're talking about, it's not then. Because what it tends to do then is it puts her and her lawyer, which tends to be more alpha, and then we have alpha beating alpha, and nobody's happy. Nobody's happy. Because then it's like. But that capacity to kind of, as my teacher taught it, relax and tune in and with a generosity, right? And the phrase I was given was, where is she? Right. Where might she be? Right. So I'm just going to listen and I'm going to tune into and find like, yeah, where. Where is there some truth here? Because there's almost always some kernel of truth in there, even if it's not to, you know, the. The certain scale or something. But it's not like this stuff's just being made up by our partners, Right? There's usually some kind of kernel in truth in there. So it can be really helpful when we can resonate in that and feel that, like, oh, yeah, I. I can see you're right. I totally did just do that. Right. And there's no, like. And I have to collapse around it. I don't have to be. I'm a piece of. Or whatever. It's just like, yeah, you're right. I totally did that. You're. You're right. That can be a game changer moment. That's that meeting energy again.

Melanie Curtin: Yeah. Thank you for saying that, because I. My experience has been women have been told that they're crazy or hysterical for a very long time in our culture and many cultures across the world for having emotions. So one of the most soothing things for me is exactly what you said of, like, you're right, that did happen. I did. I did drop you. You were dropped or whatever. Experience and thinking in particular of, let's say that we're going to an event and you're late, and I feel dropped, and you're late because of circumstances outside your control. There was traffic. There was an accident. Something happened. I think that's the perfect example of wanting to defend yourself with the facts. And she already knows the facts. You already told her about the accident. She knows. She knows. She's just trying to say I felt dropped. I went to walk in to this concert, and I had to walk in alone, and all these people were looking at me, and I felt really alone. And she doesn't want to hear about the traffic. She wants to hear you say, I hear you. That sucks. I would feel alone too. If that's true for you or whatever. It doesn't matter. But that's resonance, right? Meeting her in where. Meeting her where she's at. And that moment is, I hear you. You're right. I wasn't there. That's it. It doesn't need to be more than that. Or. That makes sense that you feel that way. That makes sense that you felt that way for me is very soothing. It's like, ugh. I can just relax and be with like, okay, good. Like, I get to be who I am. I get to actually be who I am right now. I get to actually be who I am with my man. My man is here with me, being with me. And now I'm. Now. Now it can shift. Now it can be like, okay, thank you. Like. And I get it. You know, I get it that you. There was traffic and it happens sometimes there's an accident and you can't. You know, I can shift into seeing your side, too, as long as I met in my actual present feeling state. So I. I just. Just, yeah. Wanted to. To say that. Especially this skill that we're talking about is extremely important, particularly in relationship, in what's going on between the two of us, because I do want to be safe enough in our relationship to set to share. I felt dropped. I felt sad about this thing that happened between us, between us, because I at least have spent a lot of time hiding those kinds of feelings because I didn't want to be attacked, because I assumed that if I brought it up, he would get angry or he would defend or he would resist. And truthfully, that has happened many times. Many men have defended and resisted, and it's shut me down. And I've been even less likely to bring up a vulnerability later. And that just leads to hidden resentments and all, you know, doesn't. Doesn't go well. So those are really important big moments is when. When she's sharing her feelings with you about disappointment or upset about something that you did or something between the two of you. That's really when you want to double down on all of this and really get present. And I just want to shout out to. I've been really impressed with a few of our clients lately and in the past who've kind of gone back to women that they've related with and said, I used to defend myself a lot. And I think that was really hard for you, and I'm sorry I did that. We've had a number of clients I've been really impressed who kind of reflected on their. On their behavior or on what's happened in the past and have gone back and kind of made amends with receptive partners, not with BPD partners, not with NPD partners. Totally receptive partners, where it made sense. And there's been deep healing that has happened and restoration. And I think that's another. It's almost a deeper version of you're not crazy. That really happened. I. I really did that and I see it now. And so I think there's something really beautiful about that and restorative. And I guess I just want to just. Yeah. Just give a lot of. Of praise and honor to those men and men that have. Have taken responsibility for things in this way. And like you said, without collapsing. Right. It's not that I'm a bad person or I did something wrong. It's just like, oh, I see now how what I did affected you, would have affected you. And I'm sorry. You know, there is a way that we can take responsibility and apologize without collapsing or shaming ourselves or making ourselves bad or wrong. There is a way to do that. And I really appreciate all the men in my life that have done it with me and just the men in our. In our world and our, you know, our clients that have done that. I. It's. It's really touches my heart. So just know that you've all touched my heart. Any last thing about that before we move on to.

Jason Lange: Yeah, just one footnote on that of how this often used to show up for me is I think it's really important to. To know that it's not about intent. So where I would often lawyer up and argue was, oh, well, I didn't mean that, or wasn't. That wasn't my intention. It was totally an accident that I did this thing. And then it impacted you this way. So you shouldn't feel the way you're feeling, because it wasn't my intent to. Da, da, da, da, da. And that does not work. And so what we're talking about here is even if I had the best of intentions for something and it didn't go right and it impacted my partner in a certain way, she still wants to just be met and acknowledged in. I don't. This didn't feel good. Right. It's not about whether I did it on purpose or not or anything like that, but can you still just meet her in the. Yeah, you know, that wasn't my intent, but I really get, like, you're feeling hurt or upset by, you know, what happened here, what I did or what I said or whatever that might mean. And it's just. It's like such a subtle thing, but it's a place I used to get. Cause a lot of strife for me and my partner because, again, I would be trying to defend myself in a way of like, well, you know, shouldn't be mad at me because that wasn't. I didn't do it to hurt you. But she just wants to feel like, please acknowledge that I feel hurt. That's. That's the thing she wants. Don't need all the reasoning around that, so to speak. So, yeah, just wanted to throw in that nuance.

Melanie Curtin: And it's a lot faster, like, doing it this way. It's a lot faster. It's faster. It's smoother for all parties. It really works. So I think it's also been really gratifying to witness the men that we work with in relationship who start applying some of these principles. I'm thinking of one specific client where he's like, wow, this is a lot more efficient. These scenes between my partner and me used to be hours long, days long, you know, just a Long, drawn out, horrible thing. And now it's like 25 minutes, kind of. Kind of done. And then the shifting into the. Into the next energy. And I think that's. That's kind of. That's kind of beautiful. There's something beautiful about, like. And then we really connected. Or then we. We had this really beautiful evening, right? Because when. When I feel deeply met in my. In my omega flow and I feel him really with me, then I soften that. That's what tends to happen is then. Then I soften, and then I want connection, and then I want closeness or then I want, you know, not necessarily sex, sometimes sex for sure, but just like warmth, intimacy, love. The flow of love is restored, and then we can have a really great time. Kind of like that couple that was going on vacation. They ended up having an awesome vacation. He met her exactly where she was at in the car. She softened, and then she looked up and she was like, okay, let's go. Let's have a good time. That's definitely possible. Point number three. This is a cool one. Like I said, we've covered the distress part. This is more when you're polarizing in a relationship and you just want to up the polarity. You want to up the fire. Helping her drop into Omega by putting attention on her feelings. So the difference here is, let's say I'll give my example. I got a couple of examples of omega and alpha and, you know, polarity gone right from my women friends. But I'll share mine for this. This is my story. You may have heard it before. It's not long, but I was on a date, first date or second date, some date with the guy, and we went for a hike. And then at the end of the hike, we were in the parking lot and there was that moment of like, are we going to keep hanging out? Like, what are we doing? What are we going to do now? And he came up to me and he said, what would feel really good for you right now? What would feel really good? And I really liked that question. And it dropped me into a different space than the sort of conventional question of, so what do you want to do? Or what should we do? Which is a little bit more of a thinking. So again, alpha versus Omega. Anytime you're guiding her, helping her drop into her feeling body, like how she's feeling right now, how she'd like to be feeling, anything around feelings and body is omega. So if you can help guide her in that direction, you're holding Alpha and you're probably going to polarize the moment. So when he said that just put me in a different state. And I said it was like or so. And I was like, you know, I'd really love to see the sunset. Like somehow just be somewhere where there's beauty and I can witness the sunset. And he made it happen. He was like, awesome. I will figure that out. Just wait here. And then we figured it out and it was, it was a wonderful rest of the evening. So that's a tip. Whether you're married or in relationship or dating, anything that you're going to do that's asking her about her feelings or guiding her into her feelings is going to put her more in omega again. Receptive partners who are willing will be able to do this. Unreceptive partners that are resistant. That's not what we're talking about. But if you have a willing receptive partner, that's part of how you polarize. And it's even in the way you ask questions, the kind of questions you ask. If you want polarity, don't ask her questions that are going to put her in her head or have her thinking a lot. You want to be asking questions or guiding her into feelings. Can you, can you speak a little bit to that in terms of your own experience?

Jason Lange: Yeah, it's super key. Right. And this is one of the great gifts we can bring in relationship. Right. Because this can also be in. Yeah, we notice our partner is more in an alpha place. Right. She's more in that mental space. So guiding her into her feelings in the moment is something that is really valuable. Right. When a man can guide us in there through questions, through putting us, putting our attention on that of like, oh, how's your heart right now? You know, I'm hearing all this stress about work, but I'm just, you know, how's your heart right now? How are you feeling about all this? Yeah, I just feel overwhelmed or sad. Right. Or, you know, whatever might happen, I think is so key. And you know, feelings tend to be tied to the body as well. So it's, it's about getting your partner into her body. Right. What's. What are you feeling in your body right now? Oh, I'm just, I'm feeling exhausted or fatigued or, you know, whatever that might be in the moment. In that. It's also one of the reasons that we, we work with guys to like, kind of always have a plan. Like, because one of the great things is you can feel there's an energetic difference between like, hey, like, you may have two Plans or whatever. But it's like, hey, what if we went down to the boardwalk and wrote some rides today? Like, how would that feel to you? Right there's. And then she, then she doesn't have to think about the logistics or anything or what it would take. Just like, she can just imagine like, oh, my body feels open doing it. Yeah, that feels great. Or nah, Nah. Right? There's like a, like a no there. She doesn't have to be. That part's not coming from the thinking mind. That's coming from the feeling sense in the body. So when you, when you have a plan, it's much easier to feel that than what do you want to do? Right. Then executive functioning is coming online. Well, if we go over here, there's going to be traffic. And I know you get bummed out when you're in traffic a lot and you get cranky and I don't be with you all day if you're cranked. Right. Versus totally different. That, like, here's a plan and how does that feel? Or what would you like to feel tonight? And then we kind of co create it together again. Sometimes men get, we work with, get tripped up and thinking they have to have the perfect plan always ready to go. No, it's a collaborative process, but the way to energize that collaboration is for you to be in the alpha and her to be in the Omega. So you're using the feelings of her body to help determine, you know, what's a yes, like what's gonna fire you both up.

Melanie Curtin: I think this is also why there's the classic he's giving her a foot rub. Right. That's a pretty classic image. But it's, it's, it's true. Right. There's something about helping her drop into her body, putting attention on her body and her feelings. That makes a really big difference and does polarize the moment. I want to keep going so that we make sure we get through a few more of these. Okay, Another one. This is a great one. This is if you, this is if she's in alpha and you want to feel more of her Omega flow. I think there's a lot of. Yeah. Just trying to meet her in, in, in Alpha. That doesn't necessarily work. But one thing that you can do is, is finding something to praise her for. So praise tends to drop me at least more into Omega and soften me. Right. And so it can even be praise about like something that she's doing in Alpha. It can be praise about her work. It can be Praise about how she handled something with the kids or something at school or whatever. It is like praise and approval is part of how you can polarize the moment. Right. Praise for the feminine is like mana from heaven. It's like. And it can't be fake. You cannot fit. This is not fake praise. We're not talking about faking it, but finding something to approve of with her, of her in the moment is a great way of polarizing the moment. And this can be on a date, this can be in relationship, this is wherever. Finding something genuine that you can compliment her on or praise her on. And it doesn't just have to be appearance. Like I said, it could be how she handles something or. Yeah. Or her just her alpha, like, you are an ass kicker. I see you kicking ass. I'm like, oh, thank you. Even if I was just kicking ass, right. It puts me in a different place in a different space. Can you speak briefly to that? If you have an example or.

Jason Lange: Yeah, praises. You know, I have a daily practice with my wife around this now, which I learned from a guy in one of my men's groups. And it works. It works even when it's a structured practice. Like, this is the thing I want you guys to know. Like, you can say, hey, once a day I want to stop and praise you and you think, oh, she's going to think that's fake. But if you're tuning into something genuine in the moment, it's, it's going to work. And this is a practice. I, I, as, I like to kind of work with our guys and some of the exercises we do, it's a capacity we can tune into. It's like a lens. So in this moment, what can I appreciate? Or what do I find beautiful? Or what am I loving about my partner? And so we sometimes we're not necessarily feeling that right away in the moment because I'm coming in stressed out for my day. Maybe she's stressed out for a day, but this is where you can change the energy and okay, I'm going to tune in and. Oh, my God. Yeah, you know what? I just, I love how she just handled that interaction with our kid. And I just want to praise you for da, da, da.

Melanie Curtin: Ah.

Jason Lange: And what's great about it is right when you think about praise, it's appreciating what is right. So it's, it's kind of tying back into that. Not trying to change your partner, but really expressing in an appreciation of something you've noticed about them. So it's a what's Great. It's a reflection of our capacity to be in our awareness. Because you can't praise someone for something if you're not aware, if you're not noticing anything. Right. So part of what makes it meaningful is oh, for you to praise me for that means you were paying attention. And when we're being paid attention to by a partner that feels really good and praise is something we just get to receive. Right. We receive praise. So if you're offering something to your partner, if you're praising her, she just gets to receive that. And when we're in that receptive space, that's more omega. Just. Ah, okay, great. Thank you. Right. And it works. I, it's, it's any. The other thing I'll say is, and just because you did it yesterday doesn't mean you can't do it again today. It. The half life of praise maybe isn't quite as long as we think like you can always praise more.

Melanie Curtin: Yes. And we're not talking about please and appease praise, ego. Just. Yeah. Encourage you to also think about, you know, stillness, breath, all of all of those things. It's, it's got to come from a genuine place. But we do have a lot of choice and awareness with our consciousness. We can choose what we're putting attention on. So this is more like if you want to polarize the moment as the person who wants to hold alpha, choose to put your attention on approval, on praise and see what happens. Because you might be surprised. I think it will. It's gone well for many of our men. And then the last one is a little bit more of an advanced practice, but I really wanted to include it and that is to get physical with, with approval. And I don't mean approval in the way that. Let me explain in we're not going to go over the whole thing. First stage, second stage, third stage, relating. I will include the episode about those if you're interested in that. But essentially the most advanced stage of relating includes physicality. And so for example, if I'm really upset about something, either between me and my partner or something at work and he's resonating and he's listening, he's meeting me where I'm at and then he says, let's try some pushing, let's try some pushing. I'm going to stand here with my arms out. You're just going to push against me and make just like any noise that you want to make. That would be an example of an advanced practice. Our culture doesn't teach it. It's not second stage relating, which is we're talking about things, we're communicating with words. Like it's very verbal. It's third stage relating, which is a bit more, it's just more advanced. It's just more advanced and it includes the body. So things like pushing, eye gazing. If you're like in the middle of something, you're like, you know what I'm calling it. We're doing that dance that we do where we're just going in circles. I'm going to slow us down. I'd like us both to sit on the floor and I'm going to put on a song. I'm just going to eye gaze. We can come back to everything we were talking about. It's okay. I'm not trying to shut you down. I do want to hear what you have to say. And I feel this is called for in this moment. That's an example of alpha leading, reading the moment, seeing what's called for and choosing to go in a direction around physicality. So I just wanted to. Yeah, say that. And then also I think an example of this which you've shared before but I'd love for you to share again is Violet was like really just tired, like over tired, you know, when you're just, you're just overtired and you kind of brought her, brought her into the bedroom and were like, we're going to take a nap now, we're going to take a nap now and just laid your weight on her. I think that the reason these are advanced practices is in part because this, you can only do these with partners with whom you've established trust. This is not a first date activity necessarily, but a lot of you listening have been in relationships, you've been in marriages, you've been in, you know, you've been in long term relationships or you're in one now. You do have partners where you, you can take the lead more. And this is an arena in which you definitely didn't see your parents doing this. Right. This is, these are advanced practices. These are advanced ways that you can lead as alpha that can really help polarize the moment and polarize the whole relationship. So can you share a little bit about that? And I know that we do have to wrap soon, but I'd love to hear just a little bit about this from. Because I'd imagine there's been an evolution for you and, and Violet.

Jason Lange: Yeah, it's, you know, bringing, bringing your partner into her body and contact. And so, you know, we've talked about things on the show before of how important physical touch is for our nervous system and the hormones and how it can regulate us. Same thing with eye contact. And so part of this is sometimes we can know that, oh, there's a way here, we could just talk about this all for the next five, 10 minutes. And that may or may not help. And what I know, what I know because I know my partner and we're in a consensual relationship. What I know is sometimes touch cuts right through that, right. So I can pull her in close and give her a big hug, take a deep breath, belly to belly with her. Or yeah, me and Violet will smush each other right where we'll lay on top of each other and just kind of contain each other with that weight. There's lots of different ways to, to do this, but again, it's about just getting into the body in those kind of moments or. Yeah. Evoking, you know, physical expression of some kind with some resistance or some pushing or just welcoming, you know, like a little, even a little hit it on the chest or something if it feels right between us. And we agree on that. And so these aren't without risk. But the idea is again, the body and feelings are so connected. Emotions, right, really are sensations in our body. So the more we get into our body, the deeper we can feel. The deeper we're feeling, often the more we're in our body. So the ability to guide a partner into her body and welcome her is a powerful way to polarize the moment, right. Of just, you know, and sometimes it might be as simple as just, yeah, come here and you just grab her and you just hug her, you just breathe with her or whatever that might be. There, there's a kind of cutting through, I would say in particular with, with this one that again, you know, you're probably, you might not do this on a first date, but if you're in a long term or established or just a relationship with a high amount of trust, that's where you can kind of start to play with this stuff. A little bit of like why, you know, part of what makes it meaningful in long term relationship is I know you well enough to know what supports you. And so I'm just going to bring it. Like I know this, this helps you when we make eye contact or when we hug or when I smush you or when we push or whatever. So I don't need to ask your permission for that in some sense because our hearts are actually synced on that at a deeper level than whatever's going on up above. And when a man, you know, when the alpha can cut through in that, it. It can be so liberating.

Melanie Curtin: I have a quick example of one of our clients who put this into practice with his woman. I think his woman has some trauma, like many of us, and so I think a lot of you probably know this, but for people who have had some kind of childhood trauma, their startle reflex is often more sensitive. So loud noises, things like a door slamming, can kind of jolt them into a fight or flight feeling. And this happened, I think he. He accidentally slammed a door or something happened that startled her and he could feel that she was having a reaction. And in the past, he might have tried to, like, calm her down with words or, or maybe even just try to convince her everything was fine. Right? Convinced. Try to convince the body, mind that it's not upset, which doesn't work. And instead he got still and he. He went over and he just stood right behind her just so that she could feel his body, right, could feel his body, and said kind of like softly, I'm sorry I startled you. I'm here, I'm with you. And he could feel her body relax. And then they hugged, and that was it. And he said that was a pretty, pretty big difference between how things might have gone in the past and again, how much faster it was and how much more efficient. So I think that's an example of there's a way as. As Alpha, that you can use your physical body and you can bring your physical body as a way of bringing her in. And again, you can only do that if you've done your own work. You've got to do your work. You got to get into your body, you got to be able to feel feelings, you got to get into men's groups, you got to get into community. You have to do the work to be able to be present and be and embody alpha, because you can't polarize the moment if you're not embodying. Embodying it. There's no way. You can't fake it. You can't be sort of anxious, nervous, and be like, I'm sorry I startled you. Like, please don't be mad at me. Right? You can't. If your belly isn't soft, if you're not breathing, if you're not deeply present in that moment. She can feel it. We can feel it. It's a feeling. It's a feeling. So do the work. The work works. Any last things while we, when we.

Jason Lange: Start to wrap, I think we covered quite a bit, actually. So I think that gives guys a a lot to work with. And this stuff does work. That's the thing. It's not theoretical. Like, you put this into practice and it will change your relationships.

Melanie Curtin: Yeah, I think that's one of the really rewarding things about what we do, is just hearing men's success stories. It's really rewarding. So if you do put some of these into practice and you want to share your celebrations, please do reach out@dearmen podcastmail.com and again, yeah, if you are ready to do the work, if you want to drop in and you want to become this man who can embody alpha, then go to evolutionary men slash. Apply.