I sat down with Melanie Curtin on her podcast Dear Men and we dove deep into something that's probably sabotaging more relationships than most guys realize. We talked about covert contracts, those invisible agreements we make in our heads without ever speaking them out loud. What struck me during our conversation was how universal this pattern is, and how quickly guys recognize themselves in these examples once you name what's actually happening.
A covert contract is basically when you have an agreement you made up in your head about how things should work, but you never actually talked about it with your partner. You're doing X expecting them to do Y in return, but they have no idea that's the deal. Classic example: being the super nice guy who does everything for a woman, hoping she'll eventually realize he's relationship material. Or in my own marriage, expecting my wife to always cook dinner because I'm working more, without ever actually having that conversation. Then resentment builds up on both sides because no one knows the rules of the game.
We talked about how these contracts are often a way to avoid vulnerability. If you don't actually ask for what you want, you can't get rejected in the same direct way. But the problem is it keeps you stuck in this gray zone where your needs aren't getting met and your partner doesn't even know what they're supposed to be doing differently.
One thing I really want guys to hear: asking for what you need is actually how you let your partner love you. When I'm clear with Violet about what I need, like needing masculine time outside the house after months of sheltering in place with a newborn, she can actually meet that need. It becomes this powerful thing instead of me just expecting she should know and then getting resentful when she doesn't.
If you want to start untangling your own covert contracts, try keeping a resentment journal. Where do you feel resentful? That's usually pointing right at a covert contract you're running. Then the work is bringing it above board and actually asking for what you need.
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Melanie Curtin: Right now, where's your heart? If this is hurting your heart repeatedly or your self esteem, you know, protect yourself. I think that's really what came down to, for me was I was protecting myself from. From harm.
Jason Lange: I think that's so important. And I really want, you know, guys and ladies listening to, let that one sink in, that you don't have to, like, it's actually okay. You're not a bad person. It doesn't mean you were just into somebody for the sex. Like, there's all kinds of stories we attach to, but it just means it's not right for you and you need to take care of yourself right now.
Melanie Curtin: All right. Welcome back to another episode of Dear Men. Thank you for joining me again, Jason, one of my favorite guests today. We're talking about resentment and disappointment. I'm trying to make it sound exciting because it's not exciting in real life, but this is one of the core parts of a relationship. It can be the death of a relationship. And I actually think that growing out of resentment and growing into wholeness is one of the most mature things we can do as adult humans. I actually feel like it's a sign of. It's almost like the ultimate spiritual lesson. Right. Growing beyond resentment. Because if you're actually doing it right, you're learning what your own needs are and getting them met. So. Yeah. So today we're going to be talking about a specific aspect of this pattern, and it's called covert contracts. And I'm wondering, Jason, if you could maybe give us your definition of COVID contracts and maybe your experience with them, if you've had any or what you've seen in the guys you've spoken with.
Jason Lange: Yeah. So this is a big one that in terms of, you know, a lot of what we've talked about before on the podcast and the type of work we do with the guys we coach, that really is underneath of what we would call the essence of a lot of nice guy syndrome, or the problem of being a nice guy, so to speak. And oftentimes getting stuck in the friend zone. And this term, covert contracts, is traced right down to the roots of Nice Guy syndrome and was created by Dr. Robert Glover, who is a fantastic author and a friend and mentor of mine. That this is one of those matrix moment terms that every time I come across a guy or express this to a guy, it clicks within a couple minutes and they get it and they're like, oh, crap, Right? I've done this a lot.
Melanie Curtin: I've been doing this my whole adult life. Didn't even know it.
Jason Lange: Yeah. So the essence of a covert contract is really this idea that I have an agreement I've made up in my head, like a context, rules for an interaction that I'm assuming the other party knows, but we don't actually talk about it is the idea there. The covertness is. It's under the surface, it's unexpressed, it's not shared. But the contract piece is. I have some kind of behavior I'm doing, but it's attached to an expectation that it will be met in some kind of reciprocity. Right. That's just the simple formula that Dr. Glover talks about in his book is if I do X, you'll do Y for me. Right. Which is great. That's how a lot of life works. Except the problem with this version is it's not above surface. No one knows it's happening. Or maybe you kind of do in an unconscious way, but you've never actually gotten consent or agreement from your partner to interact in this contract.
Melanie Curtin: Yeah, I was looking up a few examples in preparation for this episode. I thought this one was good. And most of these are within the context of romantic relationship. This is a sex and dating podcast. So one example. You do the dishes, let's say, when you don't normally, so your partner won't complain about you watching the game. You take your partner out for Valentine's Day, so you expect sex. You keep the house clean in order to get recognition. And I loved this particular. This is a bit longer, but I think it's really, really clear. So this is an example from uncoveringintimacy.com for example, you plan a vacation. You go through the trouble and expense of booking a three bedroom suite so the kids can have their own bedrooms. You get there and then a series of things make sex undesirable for your spouse. The 18 hour drive or a sunburn, or the baby took a long time to get to sleep, or just the stress of managing the kids swimming in the ocean. You initiate sex and get a do we have to? In your mind, you had a deal. Vacation equals sex. Perhaps over the course of the vacation, you managed to have sex once, maybe twice over the course of the week. But it's vacation in your mind that all this expense and time should reap. Daily sex. That is the COVID contract. You expected vacation in exchange for daily sex. But because you didn't express that expectation in your mind, there is a contract that is broken. In your spouse's mind, you're grumpy for no reason, which is probably going to get you less sex and not more. And I loved this example for several reasons, one of which is you're annoyed, right, that this person hasn't upheld their end of the bargain. But there was no actual bargain struck. And there's, I think, a lot of hope attached to covert contracts. I know when I've done it, I've sort of been like, there's a little bit of uncertainty. I'm like, oh, I'm not really sure, but I'm pretty sure I'm hope there's some hope and there's some expectation. And then after the fact, when it doesn't happen, now I'm pissed. Like, after the fact, now I'm resentful and angry. I'm pissed. I'm like, you didn't do what you were supposed to do, but there was no communication that that's what was supposed to happen.
Melanie Curtin: Yeah.
Jason Lange: That's one where we see tons of resentment build up. Right. Like with guys we've worked with of like, wow, I did all this stuff and then she didn't even call me back or didn't even text me back.
Melanie Curtin: Yeah.
Jason Lange: And like source a huge frustration there. So that's one really strong area. You know, we tend to see this, which again, I would kind of correlate to all kinds of different stuff about us relating to our own vulnerability of actually owning what we want with a partner and what we're desiring. The moment we own, it becomes a little more real and it becomes a little more vulnerable.
Jason Lange: Yeah, that's definitely stuff we've been processing. Two areas that come to mind are cooking. I'm lost in the kitchen. I don't know what I'm doing, and I haven't really put a whole lot of effort into trying to change that I have to own. But we did kind of fall into a pattern of there's an expectation she cooks for dinner, but it was never an above board agreement because I was juggling a few more jobs at the time. So in my mind, it made sense. Right. I'm holding more work, so you're going to cook. And that resentment would build up for her. I feel like I always have to do this. We've never talked about this, and we're negotiating ways out of that right now. One of my ways around that is a couple times a month, I would order out food for us. And so that's a covert contract I run. Well, if I'm ordering out food and paying for it a couple times a month, that balances you cooking all the time. But it kind of doesn't.
Melanie Curtin: The ledger becomes even. And like, in my head, there's this ledger running. I feel like that's such a. That's so true. We all do it. Like, here's column A, column B. Four times of you cooking equals one time of me ordering out. In my head, that's totally acceptable, but there's no discussion with the other person. And, you know, a possibility could be like, hey, I want this to feel good for both of us. I want this to feel good for both of us. Let's, like, talk about it and figure out what would actually feel good and supportive and nourishing. Because, you know, it might not necessarily be ordering out. Right. It might be. What I actually want is for this. These two things in the kitchen to get fixed. I need this to be different so that I can move more freely. Or, you know, it might be something you weren't expecting. And when you actually have A conversation. I'm curious, in your case, with the two of you, like, have you, you know, figured that out, or was it some other kind of agreement?
Jason Lange: Yeah, we're. We. One of the ways we're leaning is I'm going to learn how to make keto pizza. So I can make that, like, once a week. Like, that's like a. She would love to eat that. And I'd be like, oh, great. Okay. I think that's within the realm of what I could learn to make. So that's going to be a way I can kind of participate in that. In that, you know, another area, I think a more conscious area version of this that came up with us was maybe two or three months ago, you know, after being sheltered in place for months. And then we kind of had two months before that because we had a newborn, which is essentially, you just don't leave the house. Right. Too much. Um, I was pretty clear I needed some masculine, no demand time outside of the house. No matter. Even though I just adore my wife, I adore my child. So happy. I needed some, like, legit space. Um, and what that looked like was meeting someone up in Topanga for an outdoor hike and, like, taking an afternoon and really, like, getting out. And that was something that I got pretty clear, like, hey, this is something I need, so I need to pick a Friday. How can we arrange that? And then, you know, when can I offer you the same, right, like, where I would love to take Ruby for an afternoon at some point so you can go have some kind of experience. And that was a very conscious one. It was super above board. And that felt great, right? Cause then I, you know, I check in three quarters of the way through the hike, I'm like, hey, you know, we're still kind of meeting. She's like, it's all good. Like, just stay. There's no rush. Like, I got this. We planned for it. And it energized us both then that that was one where, you know, times past, I maybe wouldn't have consciously asked for it ahead of time and just been like, hey, I'm doing this thing. And just expected, like, haven't you noticed how hard I've been working, like, you know, and trying to co parent with you? Like, so much. Like, I could feel how that version could have been there. Like, just an expectation that I should just be allowed to go versus, like, I really need. I really kind of need this.
Melanie Curtin: Yeah, that's a good point. And I think that's a good example of a covert contract of, like, I'll do things for you so that you spend time with me.
Jason Lange: Totally.
Melanie Curtin: Yeah. Which I think I've seen many of our clients and my clients in the past go through that of unconsciously. They don't necessarily feel like I'm worthy of spending time with just to spend time with, because I'm. I'm worthy. It's like, I'm only worthy if I'm doing something for you. And so they're not conscious of it. But there's this pattern that keeps enacting itself of, I feel like I need to pick you up at the airport, or I need to help you move, or I need to fill in the blank for you so that you will hang out with me instead of just, you know, like friends, you know, it's like, we hang out because I like being with you and you like being with me. It's not. There's no. I'm not doing something for you so that we'll hang out. We just hang out.
Jason Lange: Totally. I think there's even a version of this, too, around the. And this is just me, you know, so this is not going to be true for everyone. This is just my opinion I'm going to own here. Of in some of the ways it played out for me. Of the, like, there can kind of be a covert contract of. And I'm just totally okay being your friend. Like, we kind of did have a talk, and then I'm like, well, no, I'm not just in it for the sex. I can totally be okay with your friend just being your friend. Right. And the way that sometimes showed up for me is there's kind of a covert contract there that, like, well, if I fulfill this role long enough and you realize I'm not just in it for sex. You'll think, oh, wow, he really is a great guy who doesn't just want sex. I think I would have sex with him. You know, like that's like the, you know, that's the kind of crazy shit I think back in the day. Right. Or you know, in some sense, but.
Melanie Curtin: I think so common. I think that speak to a pattern that we've seen in many, many, many of our clients, which is I, I just, if I just thought if I was nice enough long enough, she would realize how nice I am and then she would want me. And it's so confusing when you really believe that to keep having it backfire. It's jarring. It's a confusing, frustrating, resentment inducing experience. To be like, I don't understand. And then you add in like, I'm so much better than those assholes. I'm so much better than that creep that you went home with from the club. I don't understand why, why would you sleep with him and not me? I do all these things for you. I'm so nice. Why don't you see me that way?
Jason Lange: Totally. Yeah. And it can be, you know, at some point it can, it can be self harming. Right. I think we have this story that, oh, if I just do this contract, it'll all be okay. But when we talk about needs and wants for guys, sometimes there's the owning that. Like, oh, yeah, actually it doesn't work for me. Every time we get together, you know, there's a part of me attached to something happening here. And when it doesn't happen, I kind of get resentful or I kind of get hurt versus like, oh, it's actually okay. I. I have a want to like be in an intimate relationship with you and you don't want to be. So I don't have to be your friend. Like, if that's not the case, it doesn't mean I don't like you and respect you as a person. It's just like, wow, to respect myself. I'm not gonna keep putting energy into this relationship. And you know, that can be tough, you know, on both sides, I think. But I think there's something important for guys to know about their needs and wants in that. That like, you can be a guy with a fucking great heart and it still might not be right for you to stay her best friend.
Melanie Curtin: Yes. Yes. I mean, I remember vividly having, you know, those serious crushes. I had like, serious crush on a guy in high school and he didn't like me Back And I don't remember. I never, I don't think I ever explicitly told him, I like you, But I was paying attention to the signs and I was like, he doesn't like me. He likes this other girl in our group. And I stopped hanging out where he was like, you know, you sort of know people's schedules in high school. And I was like, oh, I know that if he was my crush, I was like, if I go here, he'll probably be there. So I stopped going to those places because I was like, it just felt bad. It felt bad. It felt bad to be around him. And no, you don't like being around me. Back to me, for me, it was painful. It was like I felt a little rejected. I felt a little, you know, bad. And instead of continually exposing myself to a circumstance that prompted me to feel bad, I chose not to put myself in those circumstances. And I think there's this, sometimes there's this like, well, I should be strong enough or I should be able to do it type of mentality. I'm not a fan of that. I'm like, you know what? No, like, kind of like you said, self harm. It's like, you wouldn't touch a hot stove at this point in your emotional development. That's a hot stove. So like, don't touch the hot stove. Maybe, maybe, maybe eventually down the road you'll get to a point. But it's like, but we're here right now, right now. Where's your heart? If this is hurting your heart repeatedly or your self esteem, you know, protect yourself. I think that's really what came down to for me was I was protecting myself from, from harm.
Melanie Curtin: I have a good example of this. My. My dad and stepmom. My stepmom told me the story where I think they had gone to counseling or something. And anyways, what came up was that she often felt left out when he would leave the house to go do. Do things that she didn't want to do. Like, she didn't want to play golf. She didn't want to go sailboat racing. She didn't want to do the things, but she felt a little left out. So what they came to is he would always, always invite her, and then she. She would usually say no. Like, almost nothing changed in terms of what she attended. She didn't attend anything, but she felt so much more loved. And it was an easy one that took them years. She was like, I wish we'd figured this out a decade ago, because it would have saved me a lot of heartache. And what would happen is that, you know, he would leave to go sailing or whatever it was. She would feel left out, and then she'd be a little resentful and a little cold, right? And so this whole thing would happen, and he'd be confused because it was like, I don't. I don't really know what. What happened. Like, I. When I left, we were fine. I don't really understand what just happened. And so it prevented a lot of things. And like you said, it was. She felt loved. So then instead of feeling left out, she felt loved not only because he invited her, but because they had had this conversation about how this could be resolved. And he. And every time he did it, she was like, oh, he's. He's paying attention to what we talked about. He's paying attention to this dynamic that we named, like. It just was, like, so heartwarming. And I think that's a. That's a good example of, like you said, like, the ways people need to be loved might not be what you necessarily expect. You know, you talked about cooking. One thing I've noticed is I don't mind cooking for my housemates or whoever it is if I get company in the kitchen. So it's not. I don't even need help. I don't need you to chop or anything. Just be around. You know what I mean? Just. I just need a little company that I feel, you know, I don't know, part of something or whatever. And that might not necessarily be what you would expect. It might be like, oh, you probably want me to do. Do something. Or, you know, you're even doing the dishes. And, like, I don't mind helping with the dishes. I just don't want to do them alone. I just want company. So it is important to actually discuss things. And as we wrap up here, I'm wondering if you have any advice for a man who might be listening, who might say, holy shit, yeah, I definitely have covert contracts. I'm realizing how many I've had. You know what. What steps should I take to kind of address that?
Jason Lange: Well, I have to. I'm going to start, obviously, with plugging us of, like, you can do our program.
Melanie Curtin: We're going to.
Jason Lange: We're going to walk you through identifying and starting to uncover some of what you actually need, like, in relationship and what you desire that you might be a little bit aware of and you might not be aware of. But beyond that, you know, I think it really does start with just simply becoming more aware of. You know, I like to use kind of resentments as the kind of metal detector in the world of where do I feel resentful of relationships or situations? Because, like, we were talking about, there's often a correlation there where I'm feeling resentful because I feel like I'm playing a part in some kind of contract and it's not being met. Right. Like, there's. There's Something that is obvious to me, so I assume it should be obvious to other people. And it really pisses me off that I'm not getting, you know, the reciprocity there. So just starting something as simple as a resentment journal, you know, would be one simple thing of just noticing throughout your day, throughout your week, where do you feel resentful? Okay, why do I feel resentful? And then there might be a covert contract just hanging right there of, oh, wow, yeah, you know what? I always take my coworker to work and he's never offered once to pay for gas, but I've never asked him, right? Like, it could just be something simple like that. And then, hey, you know what? I've noticed we've been doing this and I'm just wondering, would you be willing to pitch in for gas, you know, once a month or something? And they're like, yeah. And then you're like, oh, sweet, now this is fun again. You know, instead of, why doesn't he notice? I've driven every time. You know, this is one made up version of that I could see. But yeah, starting a resentment journal and then kind of decoding from there would be a huge takeaway and something we do guide guys through.
Melanie Curtin: I like that, especially because of the metal detector comment. Because like I said, I think sometimes we don't realize that we have a covert contract until after the fact. And I think not. Don't shame yourself if that's the case. It's not about, I shouldn't have done this. It's more like, oh, I see that this is here now. And then what, you know, what do I do about it? I would also add, if you are. If you. If you are resonating with this episode and you are interested in going deeper, two things. There's our program, and you can do a free training at Evolutionary Men slash training. And I would also encourage you, if you haven't read no More Mr. Nice Guy, the book by Dr. Robert Glover, I would also recommend that that's the origin. I believe he coined the term covert contract. And I think there's just a bunch of gems in that book. So again, that's no more Mr. Nice Guy, the key to getting love, sex and relationships that you really want. Something like that. There's A subtitle by Dr. Robert Glover. There's a couple different ones.
Jason Lange: So, yeah, you got. Everybody should read it. I mean, there's just some simple things there that whether you're a nice guy or not, there's some really simple concepts there that'll that make life easier? Honestly, just like, oh, okay. This is one way to approach life that's a little bit easier.
Melanie Curtin: Yeah. And ultimately feels better.
Jason Lange: Yeah, totally.
