Men, Loneliness, and Social Isolation with Jason Lange | Bringing Intimacy Back with Dr. April

Host: Sam. Welcome to the Bringing Intimacy Back show.

Jason Lange: Where intimacy is real.

Host: If you desire to intimately connect, connect.

Jason Lange: With yourself, significant other, children, family, friends, community and higher power, then this is the show for you. We explore intimate topics, inspiring life stories, spirituality, and insightful tips on strengthening relationships.

Host: The show is hosted by Dr. April and her co host, Coach K. Let's get this episode of the Bringing Intimacy Fact show started. We share with you today the secret power to intimacy to create the life you love or love the life you create. Now here is your host, Dr. April.

Jason Lange: And her co host, Coach K.

Host: Welcome to the Bringing Intimacy Back show where intimacy is real. How are you doing, Coach K? I'm doing great. How about yourself? I'm doing great. I love the month of February. Yes, indeed. Love, like history, love. Yes, yes. Also my birthday month, so. Yes, yes, yes. So sorry I wasn't here last week. Yeah. But I celebrated my birthday. And, you know, it's so great that I'm so excited about today's topic because it's one of the things that I really love to understand and I love that we are able to open this space up to just, just men in general, showing that there are places to talk. Yes, yes. So our topic today is really trying to understand men. That loneliness, that social isolation. You know, so much work is even in our fields, too much focus on the female.

Jason Lange: Right.

Host: Yes. And so to flip it on the other side, to understand it from a man's perspective and even to understand what they're going through. Yeah. That is, we as women, we can. We can study, we can read books, we can ask questions. But to. To hear it from the horse's mouth is probably more relatable to other men as well. Right, Right. Because in reality, when we study relationships and couples, the number one reason why they split up is loneliness. Yeah, yeah. And many couples, you know, sometimes they're like, the man is lonely. I don't understand that. He has football, he's the super bowl, he has the gym. We put all the things on him. Not realizing that just like we want emotional support and. And someone to listen to us. Hey. That other human being may want it to. Right? Definitely. And that's for us to show some kind of love and kindness, which talks about our charity of the month, because as we say, you know, February is the month of love. And one great thing about love or one main aspect of love is charity. And so there's a great organization that is the Love and Kindness Project foundation, which is a great organization because it highlights every act of love and kindness. And even that random act of kindness. Yeah. And like they say, part of what they say is kindness is free. And who doesn't like something that you can just do, give, receive for free, no strings attached, right? Definitely. So we had their website up. And so if you're thinking about it, please, and even just in the month of February, do a random act of kindness for someone, because kindness can go a long way. And as we relate it back to the topic, kindness in your relationship can go a long way. Absolutely. Yes. Yes. And so if you're out there and you're like, oh, I'm in a relationship, I'm struggling, I don't know if the man loves me, not love me, or men. You're like, oh, my gosh, I'm giving so much, and I'm not getting anything in return. This is the show for you. We'll be back in a moment to discuss men, loneliness, and social isolation without special guest Jason Lange. We'll be back in a moment.

Jason Lange: Life can be overwhelming sometimes. We think we are a burden to others.

Host: We think that it's better to hide.

Jason Lange: It and suppress our hurt, but it's not.

Host: As cave choral therapists, we will provide.

Jason Lange: You with quality confidential counseling services in a relaxing and peaceful environment. Talk to a professional today. Book an appointment on www.cavecholotherapist.com or call 239-565-6921.

Host: Welcome back to bringing Intimacy back. Hi, Jason. How are you doing?

Jason Lange: I'm doing great. So excited to be here.

Host: Yes, yes. I'm so excited to have you on the show, Jason, because you're. Yes. You are, as you put it, a Certified no more Mr. Nice Guy Coach.

Jason Lange: That's right. Yeah.

Host: Awesome. Yes. And so you've created a organization where you coach men and guide men in creating what, more clarity in their life, purpose, and relationship.

Jason Lange: Yeah. I support men in, you know, learning to lead in life and love and create sustainable relationships and be connected to their purpose and, you know, just feel alive.

Host: Right. And so your title of no more Mr. Nice Guy, I mean, I'm thinking, aren't we looking for nice guys?

Jason Lange: Sure, yeah.

Host: Yeah. What does that mean?

Host: As a man, how does that compete against the social phenomenon of alpha male?

Jason Lange: Yeah, totally. Well, that's part of the reaction, right, that a lot of us men, you know, we talk a lot these days about the patriarchy and its impact on women and the feminine. And it's real less talked about is it's just as damaging to men. There's this whole set of expectations that we're expected to fulfill to be considered a man, right? So they call it the man box. You either check the boxes and you're in it or you're not. And for a long time, alpha male, you know, qualities were pretty heavily ascribed to the man box. And if you didn't have those qualities, you were considered less of a man. But those same qualities are often, you know, what can be so damaging to our partners, to children, to the environment. When the masculine is disconnected from its heart in particular, which is something the alpha man can do, can cause a lot of harm. And so a lot of guys, again saw that, like, I don't want to be that kind of alpha man. So I want to be more sweet, more sensitive, more tuned, more caring. But the danger in that is then we can very easily disconnect from, from our power, our needs and our ability to actually lead, you know, in the world. So for a lot of men, the nice guy's kind of reaction to the alpha, the, the problem is neither of those are sufficient In. In the modern day to create a really thriving life as a man.

Host: So we're looking to get more into the. You're more into. Let me show you all how to work in this gray space. Instead of trying to be too. To black or white, we had guys are learning to be in that gray space.

Jason Lange: Totally. Like, so much of the work for a lot of men these days is to realize you can be strong, grounded, present, and still sensitive, attuned, caring. It doesn't have to be this either, or between power and the heart that so many men kind of get stuck in one or the other when there's this whole new capacity that's emerging and has to be practiced. Truth be told, for us men of. Yeah, I can be in my emotions and not collapse in them. Not be neat, too overly needy. But I also don't have to dissociate from them and pretend like I have no needs and I'm just too tough. You know, I don't need any help because that doesn't help anyone. Right. In the end. And those men end up suffering. So it really is. The leading edge is, you know, how to be open and sensitive and in touch with our power, our sexuality, our wants, our needs, our ability to move towards what we want in our life.

Host: Yeah. Most of the people that watch our show are probably in their 30s and. Yeah. And they're dating and trying to figure out, you know, men. And some of these men. How can I put it? They were growing up, they were told they couldn't cry, they couldn't get.

Jason Lange: Totally. Yeah.

Host: Yeah, yeah. How do you help these men who. Maybe they don't have the role models?

Jason Lange: This is. I mean, it's. It's like a widespread problem right now. I mean, you've. In the work you two do, you've probably heard it and seen it just in the world, whether it's a man or a woman, you know, stop crying. Just that thing that. Stop crying, you know, that gets drilled into a lot of kids. But I think, particularly men, that teaches us that what's happening inside ourselves isn't important. Our interiors don't matter. Right. Again, we got to be tough. We gotta. We gotta be bold. And so a lot of the work I do and why. I particularly emphasize the power of group work is for men to have the experience of seeing another man in his emotional expression and have the felt body experience simultaneously that, wow, that guy's really strong. He's in tears right now. And I could feel his power. Like, that is a man who is really showing up Strong and vulnerable in his life. And one of the. You know, one of the things is, once we see it.

Host: Yes.

Jason Lange: We're like, oh, I didn't even know that was an option. So many guys come to me, they're like, I didn't even know that was an option. No one ever showed me or modeled that for me. So I've had to hold all this stuff in all these years or pretend it wasn't there or drink it off or smoke it off or, you know, have sex to get it. Like, all these things us men do to try to regulate our emotions because no one really often gives us permission to feel them and teach us how to feel them in that, you know, having feelings does not make you less of a man. You know, as I like to say to a lot of guys I work with, like, you know, who's more afraid? The man that's afraid of his emotions or the man that just knows to go right into them, that they're part of the human experience? Sometimes I'm in grief, sometimes I'm in pain. Sometimes I'm in anger. That's all. Okay. And it doesn't make you less of a man. You know, in. Part of what I'm trying to maybe go against the culture is it makes you more of a man. And we need a lot more men who are showing up in their hearts and inviting other people into that space as well. Yeah. Wow.

Host: I love how you create these communities that men can visually see because many, many men are very visual. Yes.

Jason Lange: Yeah. Like, you know, a lot of men, we. We want the. We want the instruction booklet. Right. We want to see how it's done. And then once when some kind of models us for us, we're like, oh, okay, now I can try that. And, you know, the spaces I like to create and men's groups in particular, are a place where. Where men can, for the first time, realize, wow, it's safe to be in my emotional body and my emotional expression in a way that for a lot of guys, you know, it's.

Host: It's.

Jason Lange: Sometimes it just wasn't locker room culture bullying growing up. There's a lot of pressure to not show any weakness, to not show any emotion or vulnerability that we have to then unwind as adults in the, you know, the appropriate spaces.

Host: Okay. Yeah. So before I ask about the community, but if a man's out there listening and he doesn't know, maybe I'm not. Maybe I'm dealing with my emotions. Maybe I'm not. What are some physical things? If you're not dealing with your emotions.

Jason Lange: Oh yeah. Depression, low energy, rigidity, tension in the body, anxiety going towards substances or dopamine type activities repeatedly. This stuff has huge costs on us as men. And particularly as we start to age, it shows up even more in terms of autoimmune disorders. Our longevity. Right. You know, they have the research, you know, loneliness, just as dangerous as smoking a pack of cigarettes a day. Being morbidly obese. Like, you get sick faster and you don't live as long when you, when you're in isolation, where I'm meant to connect. And most men, again, just aren't given the tools for what to do with their emotions or even know how to label them, you know, which is why things like therapy are so important to just slow men down and help them identify. Oh, that thing I'm feeling in my body, that's, that's grief. Wow. I feel grief in my belly right now and then it kind of starts to pour out. But when we don't have that, most men just reach for the medicines that our culture says are okay, which primarily are booze, smoking, porn and masturbation cigarettes. Like these are the outlets a lot of guys have that ultimately don't help. You know, they can kind of be that short term band aid, but they don't address the, the pain underneath that once it moves like I've seen, you know, in work I've done with men, it's like, it's like a block of ice thawing and suddenly someone comes back alive. There's just like vitality in their, in their soul, in their spirit, in their presence again, because energy is moving and it's not just stuck, right?

Host: Definitely. And you're right, it affects the whole body. You know, I've seen women have had heart attacks or performance issue in the bedroom, just a variety of different things, you know. Yeah, that it just impacts them, you know, that they can't even, you know, function or think. And so as a woman, if we see a man who's shutting down, how do we go about helping them?

Jason Lange: Yeah, this is, this is delicate, right? In that for a lot of men, there's a lot of pride around providing or being strong and not wanting to show weakness. And so, you know, one of the things that I have found most men are very open and appreciative of is just appreciation. Right. A reflection of wow. I see, I see how hard you're working at things right now and I know it's really tough and I just want you to know I see that and that is Often, like, you know, just good, good vibes for us guys to receive that, hey, our hard work is being recognized, even if it's not quite going as well as we might want. Right. In our relationship or in our work or whatever that might be. And this is where, you know, it does get a little harder in that encouraging a man to, hey, you know who, what other men do you have in your life to support you? I see you're holding a lot. I see you hold a lot. And I love you and I want to hold you as much as I can. And I wonder, you know, who else do you have that can hold you out there in the world that might understand, right. What you're going through? So it's the, the encouragement, right, to get resourced, as I say, particularly with other men. It creates a space, Right. Where we can kind of just let it all out and feel unburdened and not have to be acting like we have it all together.

Host: Yeah. So earlier you talked about communities and creating communities. How do you do that with men? How do you create these communities?

Host: Do you think that social media plays a heavy role in the pendulum being either over here or way over the other side? Especially with the whole alpha male thing. Like you're supposed to be, like you're supposed to be this.

Jason Lange: I think it's. Yeah. I mean, in a sense it's, it's kind of poisonous in that it. You know, I consider social media like the sugar of connection. You kind of feel like you're getting calories, but it's, it's, it's empty. Right. It doesn't do anything for you, really. You're not getting nourished. It's not actually relational.

Host: Right.

Jason Lange: You can feel like you know somebody, but you don't know somebody. Right. Unless there's that eye contact, there's that back and forth, that in the moment present thing. So on the one hand it like hurts us because it's isolating people, even though it's supposed to be connecting us. Right. It actually creates a lot more isolation. Then on the other hand, right, whether it's beauty, money, status on social media, it seems like everybody's crushing it with everything. And the best looking people in the world with the most money, all that stuff floats to the top. And for men, you know, comparison in particular is poison. When we start comparing ourselves to, oh, he's there and I'm here, and oh my God, he's better than me, he makes more money than me, he's better looking than me. And you know, that's a human experience. But I think for a lot of men it's particularly strong. So I think it really accentuates that, that, oh my God, there's somewhere else I gotta be or some other place I gotta be at my life to be considered okay or to be worthy of love or whatever that might be. And it creates a lot of pain for men in my experience. So detoxing for that from that could be a big deal sometimes for a lot of guys.

Host: Okay. Yes. And so in reading on your website, you have a variety of different services to help men detox, like you said. Yeah, yeah, tell us about that.

Jason Lange: Yeah, I work with guys in a lot of ways. One of the primary ones is I work a lot with men around dating and relationships, and that was a pain point for me. And one of the reasons it's, I found it's a gateway for a lot of men to transformational work and getting into community is it's one of the things, it's one of the only things that Is so painful for men. They will get up off the couch and try something different. Right. That something didn't work out with a date, they got split up with their ex or something like that. It creates a lot of pain for there's something I want and it's not happening for me. I gotta do something different. And that one in particular I found is a good doorway for men that I want to have a different experience in relationships. Right. Either I'm always fleeing it, or they're fleeing me. Or, you know, as you two know. Right. Relationships are so great because whatever pattern you're stuck in, it's going to keep showing up in the relationship until you do the inner work to make that shift. Right. You know, a couple relationships, you're like, oh, it's their fault. But then if the same thing keeps happening, there's usually that awakening that, oh, wait, what's the common denominator here? Something I'm bringing to the table too. And so for a lot of men, that's a big opening. So I work with a lot of guys and have a men's group just around dating and relationships of how do we become present, integrated, authentic men who are in touch with our sexuality but are in touch with our hearts at the same time and know how to show up and lead in in powerful ways that, you know, man or woman these days are really craving in relationships. So we can. Yeah. Bring the intimacy back. I just, I love what you're up to. Of. Right. Yes. Create the skills. So, you know, for a lot of guys I work with by default in their relationships, that falls on the woman to create intimacy and drive the emotional connection forward or talk about things. And it's such a game changer when men learn the tools for, oh, I can be the one that presences that conversation or, hey, I noticed we're feeling a little disconnected right now. You know, what's going on or it feels like, you know, I have a sense you might be a little angry at me. Like, yeah, tell me, tell me what's up. Like, bring it on. You know, and that changes relationships. When a man is willing to step into that and feels like he has some skills. And then I also do some work. Yeah. I lead men's groups and live retreats where men just get to come have that experience of being around men who are showing up in a different way than most of us were raised around or modeled for us. And as part of that, you know, one of the last pieces I do with a lot with men is what I call shadow Work, which is just the process of becoming more intimate with what's actually running the show for us, which is often, you know, wounding from our childhood or needs and wants that we haven't identified that are showing up, or our inner critic or the shame. And getting men just to get more into their bodies and get more in touch with everything they're holding tends to change the game. So lots of ways I love working with men, okay?

Host: So if a man is sitting there thinking, oh, maybe this is something for, I don't know, men who, you know, are more feminine. They're going to turn me into some feminine thing.

Jason Lange: Yeah, it's a big fear for a lot of guys.

Host: Yeah.

Host: Wow. Yeah. Amazing. Yeah. And so I'm just thinking about your retreats. How long are your retreats? For me?

Jason Lange: Yes. Yeah, I have a, I have a couple different ones. I have one that's about three and a half days. I have one that's four days. And that's an opportunity. Just come in and get embodied, get connected to other guys. You know, there's, there is something unique, I think, for how a lot of men bond. We bond by doing stuff together. And so a retreat is like, you know, it's a way to channel that into more depth and connection, that we can still be doing hard things together, but we're bringing our interiority online. And it's a place where men can experience that. You know, this whole idea that, wow, when a man steps into his vulnerability, that is actually really strong. It takes strength to open, it takes strength to be vulnerable. And as we see that, it starts to connect and live. Retreats are one of my favorite places to do it. Right. Because there's just, you just get so much connection at the same time. And they're fun, right. Guys get to do fun stuff in beautiful places and travel a little bit. It's a win, win to me.

Host: Yes. Awesome. Now I'm just thinking as you feed into these men and they go back into their environment and they feed into groups there, also into their children, which is. Yes, yes. So we're building up.

Jason Lange: Totally. One of my favorite things about part of what I get to do is sometimes the check ins I get from guys on, you know, on the other side of doing some deep work or being in a group or going on a retreat. Like I just had the best afternoon, you know, with my daughter or son ever. And we talked in a way that we've never talked before and suddenly something's opened up there. And I tell a lot of guys, you know, you want to change the culture of your family, you want to change what you're passing along to your kids. Do the work on yourself. That's how they're going to absorb it. They're going to see, oh wow, mom or dad, they're, they're changing, they're growing and wow, dad knows how to cry or dad knows how to get angry. And I still trust him. He's still, he's still powerful. That's, that's how we learn this stuff. And we need it modeled to us. So it's it's one of the greatest gifts I think men can give their kids is to start their inner work journey.

Host: Yeah, I think I want you to even repeat that because I was so powerful. If men can give their children to start their.

Jason Lange: Start your inner journey. Right. So to. To slow down and take responsibility for just all of you. You know, it's not about blaming our parents or how we were raised, but there's realizing everything that happened to us had an impact. And we all have to learn certain survival strategies when we're young to get by in our system. And as I tell guys, the struggle with that is often what protected us when we were young is usually the barrier to everything we want as adults.

Host: Right.

Jason Lange: And so there's this delicate learning to honor and unwind that which I called, you know, doing the work. It's doing the inner work to learn about yourself, your body, your emotions, your feelings, your history, your past. And as you do that, things change in your system and how you show up in relationships. And that is such a huge gift to. To our children in particular, you know, for some guys I work with, when they decide to step in and, you know, sometimes it's the first time they've cried in their life or. Or for some guys, the first time they've ever expressed anger in their lives. There are men that. That goes back generations. It wasn't just them that did that. It was their father, it was their grandfather, it was their great grandfather. There's ways of being that get passed down the family line. So when a man's willing to step in and say, you know what? The buck stops here. We're gonna do this differently. I'm not going to just replay the scripts that I was given to me, and that. That takes a turning inward, and that's what can be such a gift to our children.

Host: And I'm guessing that gift goes both ways eventually. Because if. If that. If you're the model, then, you know, because our parents, they. They look at us as well, you know, and so even if, you know, dad, who is probably a baby boomer, that definitely was in that age of what are you crying for? Suck it up, buttercup. You know, so being able to see their son, you do something different, they may start tomorrow. So I think that's awesome that it can. It can swing both ways. It.

Jason Lange: Yeah, it's so cool. When we see that happening, people feel it, right? People can feel it when we start to transform in that way. They feel our presence differently, and they can feel less open and alive more and more and sometimes, you know, our parents aren't alive or our grandparents aren't alive, and I like to think it's still a gift to them because they didn't have the opportunity. Sometimes they didn't have the resources or access to the. To the healing modalities or therapies, but we do. So we're doing that work not just for us, but for them and everything. They had to suffer, too.

Host: Amen to that. Yeah. So if people out there listening and they want to connect with you.

Jason Lange: Yeah. The best way to check me out is you can go to my website, evolutionary.men. so it's not dot com, but it's dot men. And I'm on Instagram as evolutionary dot men as well. And I have a podcast and run some men's groups and have my retreats, and you can kind of just, you know, plug in and get a vibe for what's possible in terms of a different type of relating and community with men.

Host: All right, Definitely check them out. Wwevolutionary.men. yes. It's been a pleasure to have you on. You're welcome back anytime. Yes. And thank you so much. Thank you.

Jason Lange: Yeah, thank you, too, so much for having me and for doing what you do. Intimacy is super important to me, and a lot of us just don't have the training, so it's amazing to have two like you leading the way to create spaces that, hey, we all want that. We're all craving it. So thank you.

Host: Thank you. We'll be back in a moment.

Jason Lange: Improving Intimacy Everyday Expressions is all about.

Host: You and your partner.

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Host: Every second of life you create.

Jason Lange: Together with your partner, Everyday Expressions will educate you and open your eyes to.

Host: Just how great your relationship could be. With a little tlc, Improving Intimacy Everyday Expressions provides a true baseline for the strength in your relationship you've been looking for.

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Host: Welcome back to the Bringing Intimacy show, where intimacy is real. Wow. Coach K, that was just. That was amazing. Yeah. Yeah. Powerful. Yes. Yeah, I love everything was just. It was very insightful and very informative and very helpful for the guy that is out there saying, I want that, but I never knew where to get it. And now there is a place. Right, Right. And he does it online and retreats for them to go and, of course, experience it, which is wonderful. Yes, yes. So what's coming up Next. All right, we have some great shows coming up in the coming weeks. So on February 8th, we have 10 best date night ideas for unforgettable evenings. That'll be with Dr. April and myself. On February 15th, we have spice up your love life sexor sizes for a fun time that is also with Dr. April and myself. And then on February 22, we have intimacy and demisexuality with Love Atiya. Can't wait to hear that one. Yes. And definitely great show, sir. If you've been listening and you really miss part of it, definitely go back and listen to this. About the importance of men, their emotions and how we have a resource now and a place for them to go and get connected. Definitely. Because emotional intimacy is everything. It's the juice of all the other intimacies. So you're struggling with that and with your man or he's struggling in himself overall. Definitely. Check out Jason Lange. So this has been the Bringing Intimacy show where intimacy is real. I'll see you guys next week. Bye, everybody. Thank you for listening to today's episode of bringing intimacy back where intimacy is real. You can also find [email protected] LinkedIn, Facebook.

Jason Lange: Instagram, Twitter and YouTube.

Host: Dr. April Brown's seventh book series, Improving.

Jason Lange: Intimacy, is now on Amazon. We'll see.

Host: See you next Thursday at pM don't.

Jason Lange: Forget to follow, share and subscribe.